Animation Source Forums

Before I start, I want to remind you, that although the title says arguments, it doesn't mean great big flame wars. So keep it chilled everyone!

There have been topics and articles here on Balto Source, of people believeing the real Balto was half wolf. This is rubbish everyone! He was NOT half wolf. People seem to say that they have read this in books, this may be true. But don't believe it! Balto was not a wolf/dog, he was a husky. And Balto wasn't a Alaskan Malamute either, he was a husky. End of story. Though, all huskies are really a mix of a lot of breeds actually, and sled dogs aren't all huskies. But thats different.

Now, I looked through everything to do with Balto and the info above is my results. So no more wasting space with silly topics about the real Balto being 'half wolf' please. Thanks!

Balto REALLY looks like Russo-European Laika!
But mushers often "makings" wolf hybrids, because they wants strong dogs for sleds.
I hear about Balto's DNA tests, but I don't know it's true..

As I mentioned in the topic of Cartoon of Togo,Togo might have possibly been the inspiration for Cartoon Balto.

I don't know of any reliable mushers ever trying to create wolf hybrids for sledding. That would be a tragic mistake...wolf hybrids are not reliable for that kind of work, which requires an animal of a breed developed, over a vast amount of time, to do the job it can do. Wolves don't have that in their blood. So I think you've been misinformed.

Regardless of what Balto may LOOK like, he was a Siberian husky of the Chukchi stock. Pure and simple. End of story. Case closed.

The historic Rin Tin Tin is a German Shepherd. And yet, there are plenty of other breeds which look a heck of a lot like German Shepherds (and are related to them). Does that mean we should call Rin Tin Tin a "Belgian Malinois"? No. He's a German Shepherd, pure and simple. Just as Balto was a Siberian husky, pure and simple. The records at least show that much.

Sorry if that sounds rough and mean, but it's getting irritating for people to keep coming back to discussions about Balto being what he definitely was NOT. And that whole wolf hybrid for sledding thing, that was way out.

Thank you Seppala! That's just what I have been trying to say here

Quite welcome, Highland. Glad to be of assistance...

(One thing though...I have never heard that "all huskies are actually a mix of several breeds" - or what you said. The original Siberian husky, now known as the "Seppala Siberian Sled Dog", is a pure breed.)

Balto may look like the Russo-European Laika, but there is no way he could of been one. Firstly, the Russo-European Laika's original range was in western Russia and Finland. The Ural Mountains defines the eastern boundary line of this breed. The dogs imported to create the Siberian Husky were all pulled from tribes on the Bering Sea coast, which is well east of the Ural Mountains. Secondly, the Russo-European Laika, along with the Karelo-Finnish Laika, West-Siberian Laika, and East-Siberian Laika, is primarily a hunting dog, not a sled dog. Obviously, they can pull a sled if needed, but they aren't specialized for it.

The four Laika breeds, the Samoyed, and the Siberian Husky are all Spitz types and they all originated in Russia, Finland, or Poland. Thus, they have overlapping height ranges, have double-coated fur, and similar coat colors (though the Samoyed is limited to only three colors which are white, cream, or biscuit). As stated earlier, Laikas are hunting dogs and thus are used to hunt everything from squirrels to bears. The Samoyed is specialized to do two things, herd reindeer and pull heavily-loaded sleds. The Siberian Husky is an endurance sled dog and pull medium-sized loads at a medium speed over long distances.

As for wolf-dog hybrids or wolves, generally they are not used as sled dogs. Although there have been some notable exceptions, they do not make for good sled dogs. They are too independent and territorial which tend to lead to problems when around other canines. Mushers have enough problems with dogs as it is, let alone wolf-dog hybrids or wolves.

Before I forget, thanks Coaster for your post, glad you understand about this! Back to Seppala!

Hmm, maybe I should have made that slightly more clear. Well, I should have actually said "most sled dogs are a mix of several breeds" (I know, the two are way off, I just didn't really have that much time to right this up).
I was talking to one of Scotland's few mushers and he told me that none of his dogs (which is over 30!) are Kennal Club regestered. Because as they are all mainly "huskies" as such, except for the pointer dogs of course, but none of them are pure blooded. Before, when dog teams were used for transport and all, in the time of Balto, any dog would do. As long as they were strong, fast, capable to run as a team ect. so basically make a good sled dog, any breed would do. And they would be breed because of their qualities as a team player. There are hardly any pure bred sled dogs today, even if they are classified as husky, they probably have lots of other blood relations in them. A pure bred Siberian Husky would rarely be found on a sled dog team. Like this musher said to me,
"Looks is not what you want in a sled dog,"

I hope you understand what I mean And do tell me more about these "Seppala Siberian Sled Dogs"! And tell me what you think of this post, I will stick to what I believe in but you could prove me wrong is some places! Its good to discuss about these things

Your welcome Highland Wolf. I just thought that a clarification of the hunting specialization of the four Laika breeds would dispel any more thoughts about Balto being one of the them. I like Spitz type breeds and find Laikas to be very fascinating. I would like own one in the future if I do not get into dog sledding.

I agree that most racing sled dogs are not purebreds mainly because the Alaskan Husky and Eurohound have dominated all races not restricted to purebreds (which is most of them). When purebred teams enter unrestricted races, they finish mid-pack at best. In the Iditarod Trail Sled Dog Race, the fastest time for a Siberian Husky team is more than three days behind the current record. There is a notable exception though. In 2004, Blake Freking of Manitou Crossing Kennels won the John Beargrease Marathon Sled Dog Race (375 miles) with at team of ten Siberians and two Alaskans. His wife, Jennifer, finished second in that race in 2005. Last season, the two finished second and third in that race. In other races, they usually finish mid-pack or better, with the exception of the 2005 Yukon Quest in which Blake finished last but only 11 or 12 teams finished that race.

More later, my laptop is running out of battery power.

That's because the modern Siberian Husky, as I've said elsewhere on this and other sections, is not the same animal it was when it was brought over by people like William Goosak and Ramsay. The Seppala Siberian Sled Dog (a rarity, and sometimes wrongly referred to as the "working line" of the Siberian Husky breed) is the original Siberian husky.

Gladly! My intent, of course, is not to prove you wrong, but to educate, and to dispel some of the misconceptions and myths perpetrated even by those who are dog people (even BREEDERS). At least, to the limits of my knowledge and what I have learned. Heck, I'm still on the learning curve too. Here, in this topic (starting a few posts down...the third, fifth and sixth posts are key, is information about the great dog breed which gave rise to the modern Siberian Husky, and once bore its name: http://baltosource.timduru.org/board/viewtopic.php?t=8646. (Of course, we talked about the breed in this topic, you and I. Have you forgotten?)

Note, when you look at the pics, the physical differences which STILL make the SSSD a champion runner...the longer legs, lighter frame, and generally shorter coat. THIS is the breed to which Togo, Fritz, Fox, Balto, Scotty, Suggen and many other great dogs of the time belonged. NOT the modern Siberian Husky, which was developed through the 1930s and onward to have shorter legs (thus making it slower), heavier coat, etc. While the modern Siberian Husky is STILL a wonderful dog, it is not the sledding marvel it's ancestors were. It was overbred and inbred by the idiots in the show and conformation circles to be a "pretty" show champion and pet, not a sledder. And with those shorter legs and heavier coat (and its original purpose slowly being bred out of it), the modern Siberian Husky is losing ground to other sled breeds, as Coaster indicated.

Ah yes! I renember now, Seppala. I did forget about that I'm afraid, there is just so much to talk about on this board!

I see now more clearly about the Seppela Sled Dogs. It is a pitty that huskies are now bred for show, when they should be used for work. I am torn two ways sometimes. I really want a Siberian Husky as a pet, but I know that it is not a good idea. They are meant to be workers for sleds and not for show dogs and pets. It is so confusing, and tough to handle this problem.

It is a shame that the UK is going the way the US has already gone and many huskies are starting to be bred for show, however most of the breeders also race.

In the last few years though show judges have been favouring the shorter legged, rounder body style dog however a lot are staying faithful to the original shape.

In fact I remember an article in the club magazine showing the earliest photo of a siberian husky and comparing it to a modern average UK dog. They looked very similar in shape

Well, thats good to now Ac

Well, as you can see from that topic (and this is for your attention too, Ac), it IS possible to acquire Seppala Siberian Sled Dogs in Europe! So if you want a champion-quality runner, with the genetics of Togo's line, they are the ones! However, Siberians do make good pets, if you have the right conditions (secure backyard, etc.). Even SSSDs can. But they do need to run. And for that, they need lots of exercise.


If you read a lot of these "working husky" sites (these are the breeders who also do dog sledding...show breeders rarely do...at least it seems that way in the U.S. and Canada), you'll find that what is really happening is that the breeders are crossing modern Siberian Huskies with Seppala Siberian Sled Dogs to bring back some of the original genetics into their lines...thus creating what they like to call "the working line Siberian Husky". They'll talk about a dog that is 80-90% one thing (usually husky), and 10-20% Seppala Siberian Sled Dog (or vice versa). It's a common practice, now that the SSSD is starting to get more notice even in the sled dog community. The Siberian Husky the world over is probably the same...shorter leg and heavier coat (and less drive) than it's ancestors. It's the crossing with SSSDs that has created the "workable" modern Siberian. Of course, it's also possible that an occasional genetic variant will pop up in the modern Siberian lines, and have longer legs and lighter coat (and more drive). It's my estimation, however, that breeders (especially working line breeders) are trying to reintroduce the original genetics back into an overbred and inbred dog breed, and freshen it up. Not a bad idea really. So many purebred lines (in any breed) can only go so far before they need outcrossing in order to continue prospering.

Heh heh. And I'm neither a breeder, nor musher, nor geneticist. I just have read enough about this to know what's going on.